e e e e well good evening everyone SEO Anu n waa ququ as the mayor of the city of Kingston I offer these words in the spirit of this Gathering let us bring our good minds and hearts together as one to honor and celebrate these traditional lands as a Gathering Place of the original peoples and their ancestors who were entrusted to care for Mother Earth since time in Memorial it is with deep humility that we acknowledge and offer our gratitude for their contributions to this community having respect for all as we share this space now and walk side by side into the future okay so we were meeting uh as Council in committee the whole Clos meeting we did discuss uh several items respect to um the uh uh pending acquisition or disposition of land by the municipality or local board at the Limestone District School Board we discussed employment lands the Olt appeal for 4085 Bath Road and collective bargaining with QP local 109 so I will ask for a motion to rise without reporting please moved by councelor Amma seconded by councelor channy that Council rise from the committee of the whole close meeting without reporting all those in favor opposed and that's carried uh next we have the approval of the added I believe we just have some Communications can I have a mover and a seconder for the added please move by councelor TOA second by councelor Steven all those in favor opposed and that's carried are there any disclosures of potential pecary interest C Steven I Wendy Steven of the corporation of the city of Kingston declare my pecuniary interest in the matter of close session item a as I am an employee of the Limestone District School Board okay thank you uh seeing no other Declarations of Peary interest then we will uh move on in our agenda we have no presentations this even evening uh but we do have several delegations uh so first I will invite uh Emma Lambert to from tourism Kingston to appear before Council to speak to New Motion number one regarding the Cricut field at 32 bagot Street and just a reminder to all of our delegations you have up to five minutes to speak uh and then we will open up the floor to questions from members of council Miss Lambert welcome and you have the floor thank you mayor Patterson members of council and City staff my name is Emma Lambert man manager of sport Partnerships with tourism Kingston I'll be speaking this evening from a sport tourism perspective of the motion to council to revisit the plan for Cricket fields at this site we now have a state-of-the-art sport infrastructure so recently built a project that required the city of Kingston to invest over $1 million and a th000 staff labor hours I say with confidence that removing the Oatfield fence would significantly decrease both the value and utility of this revitalized field with our present day strategies in place for tourism and Sport development it's important we evaluate the opportunity this significant sport investment presents our community moving forward now I know there are folks here this evening from our local baseball Community some of whom you'll hear from in just a short while their support for this motion is matched by enthusiastic voices across our city who give so so much to our local sport community and who want to see this field remain intact now we know Cricket Fields is a sport facility with an incredibly long and important history and it remains a living Legacy it continues to serve our community as a regular home for youth baseball and with an outfield fence it's a stage on which to welcome the nation's very best young athletes now when the opportunity first came up through the Kingston baseball association or kba to host a national championship in 2024 the city of Kingston and tourism Kingston jumped on board because of the direct Al alignment with our integrated destination strategy specifically section 25 of the IDS outlines the need for investment in sport facilities as Community assets that benefit our local sport clubs and provide significant hosting opportunities for our city removing the fence would be to take a step backwards it would pull Kingston from future hosting considerations in the eyes of Little leag Canada right now with the fence the field New and ready as it is we have a massive competitive Advantage I must say we are the Envy of my sport tourism counterparts in other communities with this facility it's the newest Little League field in Canada and has put Kingston on the map as a premier host destination for major baseball tournaments as well as providing a safe sport space for our local athletes some of whom are here tonight our local athletes can now be proud to play at home here in Kingston I mean the most recent case study we have of course is the summer successful Little League championships it generated over $2 million in economic impact yet it wasn't just a successful sport event it was an integration of community assets we activated hotels and restaurants and attractions I think all of us enjoyed seeing the bright red trolleys filled with young baseball players traveling through the city taking players from games to practices to Kingston pen tours to their accommodations at Queens we celebrated Heritage with ceremonies throughout the tournament we hosted past Builders integrated local music and trained new sport volunteers kba even took the opportunity to host the first L League girls matchup in the region a springboard for the growth of girls baseball here in Kingston our community showed up and as a result we've been shortlisted to host the U13 version of this National Championship next summer this city Shawn through the tournament and this will not happen again if we don't keep the Outfield fence in place so currently this field with this fence we have the opportunity to host a number of significant events outlined here that would drive a potential of $5 million in economic impact each and every year over the six month period that this field can be in use now it's important to highlight that these events will come to life entirely on the backs of local volunteers from the baseball community and they are willing to take on this work the least that we can do as a city is ensure that we keep this state-of-the-art field intact so that these events can take place now the main user group of the field and the volunteers behind this Summer's Canadian championships is kba I ask Council to join me in trusting and encouraging the Kingston baseball association as they demonstrate continued good governance capacity for growth commitment to girl Sports and lucky for Kingston a willingness to give thousands and thousands of hours to host these major events now in my portfolio with tourism Kingston we maintain a facility guide that outlines our Sports assets and currently on the baseball front we are stronger than ever before of course a gold standard baseball diamond looks different in 2024 than it did in 1872 when the first game was played at Cricket Fields but by keeping this Outfield fence we can ensure that Cricket Fields value and place in our community continues to stand the test of time I greatly appreciate your consideration of this matter and I'd be more than happy to take questions before you hear from kba directly thank you okay uh thank you are there any questions from Council uh councelor Glenn thank you Miss Lambert for your presentation and uh for explaining uh how well the tournament went um my one pressing question for you though is how did we manage to win this baseball tournament when we didn't even have a field suitable for play and we're contending now that we must keep the field fence up to win other tournaments um I think I mean it was before my time in this role certainly um but in 2019 and I think this is a good reason for the motion this evening to to Really enable further Community consultation I think we look back at 2019 when the bid to host this tournament was first submitted uh that goes to Little League Canada it was supported by the city at the time our council at the time I should say um tourism Kingston at the time and was led of course by the Kingston baseball association and we were selected on the premise that Cricket field would be explored and then invested in as the city chose to move forward with to host this tournament um I would say that's pretty standard practice when it comes to sport hosting on the um premise that sport events and enable communities to invest in infrastructure the fact that we hosted the tournament this summer means that we now have the state-of-the-art Little League field the newest and currently best in Canada um that was made possible because of that investment that was decided upon in 2019 I think the reason to revisit it now is that certainly the sport landscape has changed there's of course um you know I think consideration to be made for what the process was at the time I think we could all review that and potentially move forward differently in the future when it comes to having these different parties at the table um but I think 5 years have passed we know that times have certainly changed I think in in your District councelor Glenn there's there's new concerns from the community that perhaps didn't exist in 2019 perhaps they weren't consulted to the level that they should have been in 2019 all the more reason I think to pass this motion and and do that important work now um from a sport perspective certainly with volunteer attrition with sport facilities not in the same state that they used to be there's there's a need to I think revisit this um and and really leverage this opportunity that we had to host this tournament and the Legacy that can be left moving forward thank you okay uh councilor shapes thank you um just to further on that question is it normal practice for cities or countries to um bid on certain events such as World Cup or Olympics say without the actual facilities by when they actually win in the bid that then they actually are building the facilities to match what the needs are certainly yes um I would say that is extremely common uh in that a proposal would need to be put forward outlining what the fields of play will look like once the bid is secured then that's when the investment comes in the sport infrastructure and partners come to the table okay thank you thank you okay if there are no other questions um M Lambert thank you very much thank you uh we'll now move to our second delegation we'll invite Tor bosart to speak to council again with respect to New Motion number one regarding the Cricut field at 32 banket street thank you mayor Patterson members of council and City staff uh thank you for allowing me a few moments to speak to you today I'm here to advocate for maintaining the Outfield fence at our beloved Cricket baseball field this fence is not merely a physical bound it is an integral to the functionality and spirit of our field for several compelling reasons before we discuss those reasons I aim to give you some background on the growth of our club that we've experienced over the past few years for the past 10 years we are seeing growth and have recently recognized a need for development in our girls game with a focus on inclusivity we have focused on bringing in diverse Role Models engaging community and involvement in creating a supportive environment for our players to learn not only baseball skills but the principles of little league fair play sportsmanship positivity and teamm ship as you can see by the increase in the amount spent each year with the city of Kingston We are booking as many fields as possible to try to accommodate the many players as many players as possible with more space needed this year and Beyond to support the growth of our girls game especially by losing Cricket field for the past two years while it was being renovated uh we had weight list in almost every division that we have uh forcing us to turn away players which we hate doing prior to the renovation of cricket field both diamonds were booked by kba 5 to seven days per week from May until October and use a variety of different divisions this was still the case even though the field was not set to a proper size it was sized at a 6090 base path and pitchers path uh and players over the age of 14 really couldn't use that space due to the amount of area they would it would hinder the houses the roads cars and the nearby park uh The Outfield fence provides a clear defined boundary that ensures player safety without it balls hit Beyond certain points can lead to injuries as players and Spectators would be exposed to unpredictable bounces potential accidents the fence also ensures a Level Playing Field preventing balls from rolling into the areas that are uneven uh if you know the field at all in the left field out past the fence line there's considerable slope there which does come into play for the players the fence contributes to the overall Aesthetics of the field giving it a professional look that boosts Community Pride it creates a space where families and friends can gather and enjoy the game in a setting that feels both organized and welcoming a well-maintained fence enhances the Field's appeal and makes for a more attractive venue for tournaments and local events while there are a number of baseball diamonds across the city there are ongoing challenges with each of those spaces especially to host a tournament of this size magnitude the other fields are not up to the standards for provincial or national hosting and see teams traveling from out of town maintaining the Outfield fence is a wise long-term investment it helps provide the fields usability and value over time by ensuring the fence is kept in good condition we avoid potential costs associated with repairs and modifications that might be needed if the fence was removed moreover it allows us to continue with hosting provincial and Canadian championships after the success of the 2024 Canadian Little League championships we have been approached for hosting a variety of different championships in 2025 and so on Kingston is widely recognized as a beautiful historic City the Little League organization is steeped in Tradition and history founded in 1939 it has become a global Phenomenon with millions of kids participa in over 80 countries it focuses on fostering a sense of community and camaraderie with this new field and fence our local little league players now have a high quality field to train and compete 30 seconds what better way to honor a long baseball history at Cricket field than to maintain it as a baseball facility to the highest standard of the game and benefit the youth in our community Cricket field has a rich history and a tradition within our community The Outfield fence is a part of that tradition symbolizing countless games memories and local Pride keeping it intact honors its history and supports the continuity of cherished Community Asset in conclusion I pres preserving The Outfield fence is not just maintaining a physical structure but also upholding the safety enjoyment and tradition of a baseball field great thank you very much okay we'll open up to uh questions from Council Council rich thank you worshiping through you uh thank you so much for the presentation I really do appreciate it uh I was just wondering uh if I could just look at the growth for your your organization for a moment I believe it was the second slide potentially the the third okay that's it awesome so um one thing that I always love to see is to see young people getting involved in in these types of recreational activities and clearly we can see from the growth of the organization that that is the case 47 female registrations jumping to 71 girls fantastic well done thank you so much yeah thank you okay are there any other questions councelor Glenn thank you very much for your presentation and for all the hard work that you put in uh in getting the tournament here um I have a couple of quick questions so back to those numbers that that we're looking at right now um what were your numbers like pre pandemic because I know that that's been a challenge when we look at numbers seeing the recovery versus what was prior to uh to that do you have those handy if not I don't I don't have them specifics I can send them to you uh but I do know a rough number so back in 2012 we were down to 76 players in our league uh total and uh from there it was continual growth so every year we saw growth until we got to 2018 it dipped by 22 players and then it continued to grow again even through covid we sustained our numbers and grew which was uh it was a feed on its own really so um yeah we've we've shown a continual growth over the years okay thank you um and can you tell me how long your baseball season is yeah yeah so games begin in May the 1 of May as soon as the fields open up from the city uh we get out there we're usually on the turf fields in April with triy outs and uh preseason training and then game begin in May and we're still running games now we have a tournament this weekend uh so we run as late as the city allows the fields to be open which this year we're being told October 15th okay thank you very much I appreciate that no problem councelor Sun thank you you worship and through you um if the city decided to move that fence and not have that feel for the young players how is going to affect their activities in this age and how it's going affect the organization and those player how difficult will it be for them to go somewhere else and play well with or without the fence we would still use that field every day for some reason it would definitely affect the tournament level that we're able to host um I think that's really the biggest key uh there would be no provincial tournaments and there would be no National level tournaments with that fence unfortunately so follow-up question and the last time you guys host the championship or or the league how many people approximately came to Kingston to with those players to watch the game or how he was impacted to economy so for the Canadian championships we had seven teams from across Canada uh and their families and supporters were all here Emma could probably speak more to those numbers in the amount of hotels that were booked throughout the thing that makes a little Le ter tournament kind of special is how long it runs so that tournament ran from July 28th through August 8th so that's uh 10 days of uh families being here and supporting the local community supporting our economy yeah okay if there no other questions thank you both very much oh I'm sorry Council Roff I had you on the list and I forgot yeah go ahead no problem thank you mayor Patterson yeah thanks for that um presentation done really well um and and great work on your behalf and so many others um how quick maybe I should know the answer to this but I don't is there are there fields in Ontario that they can put the fence up quickly for tournaments or don't know if that's possible like I understand why it's so important I I love the game too but I don't know is that is that have you seen that there where you can prepare for a tournament uh in like a couple days or like does that happen I I know it no I no not a couple days for sure okay I don't know um there is such thing as temporary fencing um temporary fencing is very costly I know that at one point in the planning process um it it was explored they looked into it um and I think was quickly ruled out because of the cost okay um and it does take a lot of manpower to put up and down and up and down down on a daily basis storage safe storage was another concern as well yes understood thank you for that thank you mayor Patterson okay don't think I missed anybody else thank you so uh thank you both very much okay uh we'll now go to our third delegation we'll invite David Gordon to speak to councel again with respect to New Motion One regarding the cricket field [Music] good we're here um thank you your honor I'm Dave Gordon uh my family live at 67 syum Street in downtown Kingston um I was one of the people who attended most or not are all of the many and long negotiations uh about the design of the baseball diamond in 2022 we've had lots of negotiations with the community already my family have lived um within a couple of blocks of the cricket field for the past 30 years our daughter attended the adjacent sidam public school and uh where I was a parent coach and we have detailed knowledge of the use of the cricket field because we walk or cycle by it every day my wife was the chair of the of the parents Association for sitam public school so this context um Cricket baseball and fastball have been played on this site for over 150 years never with an outfield fence this field is the only public playing field in downtown Kingston it serves 25,000 or more local residents it's heavily used for an astonishing variety of activities 12 months a year I've seen softball cricket baseball fastball football frisbee quidditch kite flying rugby golf yoga cross country skiing school events summer camps snowshoeing there are family picnics there on the cricket field there's dog walking by people who clean up and people just enjoying L lounging on the large green space the park used every day 12 months of the year the negotiate now this school uh sorry this field has been the playing field of the adjacent downtown sdam public school since 1853 it's the place where the kids in this school because the school has just uh has no yard no playing field it's where the 120 kids in this school use as their Playfield every day there's an adjacent School uh the other downtown school at C Cathedral is two blocks north they use the school but not as frequently um the this is the place where Simon Whitfield learned to run uh before he won his gold medal in Triathlon it's a place where kids have played soccer for over a hundred years um and a large part of this Playfield at Barry and Court Street that was formerly used by the schools is now fenced locked and gated and inaccessible to the children of the community because the Outfield fence which was agreed to be removed has not pupils returned this morning everybody's happy but I don't know where they're going to play to the same extent here was the deal the former baseball field was popped in the middle of the the uh Park in a not great location but the cheapest place you can build it at the time the flattest and cheapest place it had a long out outside porch uh but a short porch on the right field uh I could uh easily hit the 200 ft to that side the deal was that the cricket field with all the the baseball diamond with all the extra apparatus that's attached to it takes up a lot more space and instead of plopping it in the center of the thing very clever work by your staff we dragged it back to the bottom corner and tucked it into the corner just like the fastball field at the top so that the two Fields could be shared now we lost the playing field or the playing area that was between Barry Street and the diamond but the loss of that was made up for by a larger Central area that will be shared in the future we willingly gave that up we willingly gave up the use of our public park for over a year and a half while it was in construction and fenced off on the condition that the fence would be removed afterwards so that we would have a larger space in the middle that was usable by all 30 seconds so could you know uh a larger uh space for the community use for the uh maybe Cricut to return and the agreement we supported this in um and there was a sign put up uh on the site from the city recognizing the agree agreement uh so the community wouldn't complain and if the Little League wants to have a fence or if people want to have a fence this is in the wrong place it's tuck it's at 200 ft okay if we wanted to have a full baseball F field we should have a longer should be marking it okay okay thank you very much are there any questions from Council uh councel too thank you mayor Patterson through you just a question for the delegation U do you use the field for any extracurricular activities or any alternative leagues absolutely the you know we um the the school uh us do you currently use it oh yeah yeah no I go but but in fact there is my bike on the field on the way way home uh we uh uh run people's uh dogs I've shagged flies on this uh d diamond for kids in the neighborhood um uh so the fields in uh very frequent use last week I saw a family trying to use the the the Little League field the fence is this High trying to lift their kids over the fence because it's locked and padlocked nobody's allowed in and they couldn't so they ended up using the fastball field instead okay thank you oh next is cancer of Sanic thank you your worship um I just wonder that in 2022 or maybe 2021 when you were having the discussions with staff and sdim District Association were there representatives there from the little league and and they were aware that the fence would be temporary yes uh the the staff were negotiating with the little league who wanted the fence to be there afterwards but they understood that the deal was that it be uh that it be removed um and uh so we're kind of disappointed more than disappointed we're really angry that the school year has started up again and we haven't got our uh School playing field back thank you and my second question is um I know that you're a planner like an official planner with Queens University and whatnot do you think having the fence there um will affect um just the overall you know feel of sdnm District being like a Heritage Conservation District what's wonderful about the cricket field is it's a large green space um framing the the uh Courthouse um and uh the baseball diamond being moved further into the corner enhances that um except for the the fact that the the suddenly there's a 4-ot fence with yellow thing cutting across half the field so that makes it worse but if the fence was not there except when there's a tournament on um then the Heritage aspects of the of the park would be there but it's just better Park design you don't design a downtown Playing Field park and um for just one use you this space you can see how worn the grace grass is in the other place is used for all kinds of things all during the year year way past the amount time that the little league uh uses it for so to make it exclusively a facility for one thing and not let the public in for the rest that's a really bad Park design and um we don't support that uh at all thank you councilor Steven thank you mayor Patterson through you thank you uh just one quick question how would you feel about the park or the the the field itself if the lock didn't exist there the it would still uh cut the the area available for uh playing by about a third and the fence is quite visually intrusive uh from uh from all the other direction the fence is removed it's going to be like the softball diamond on the other side it'll barely be visible the fact that there's a baseball diamond in the corner and of the city's million-dollar investment in the thing it's only the the five or uh $7,000 in that Outfield fence is the part that's removed everything else we're perfectly happy to have Remain the dugouts the pitching areas the bleachers all those things that take up so much of the rest of the park don't have to be removed at all and if there is a tournament again in the future we'd be perfectly happy if there was uh if there was um the fence was put up again temporarily and I offered to contribute the $1,000 towards the price of a temporary fence um which we costed it less than $10,000 so if you want one that you can put up whenever you need need it um they're available and used in baseball diamonds all around North am America this is a bad decision bad Park planning okay Council Glenn thank you and through you thank you for your presentation Dave and um for talking to us about Park planning a bit um so given your background can you give us a little bit of uh explanation on you know having an open space and what travels like across there I know that you've talked about biking through it and people Traverse the park and what does that fence do in terms of just natural walking through a Park which is is part of what a park exists for well you can see it cuts one of the the paths that people use just from this slide uh above but more important it it it um it's a visual intrusion that um stops you from uh from walking in many different directions across it and would stop you from from playing on the park too the uh so it's it's really too bad the uh that that would uh happen and it's it's just not good design okay thank you and just one last question um in terms of how the park actually feels to the people who live there and the use of the people on an everyday basis how does that change it with the fence still up we feel like we're being excluded from our neighborhood park you know um it was equally bad if our school suggested for example that we want to put up permanent soccer nets because it's used more months of the year for soccer than it is for baseball we were going to put up permanent soccer nets that'll block the outfield for little yuuse that would be bad planning too but we would never suggest it we to bring our pylons out and take them away at the end of uh of at the end of the game okay there are no other questions oh c shaves go ahead um if I recall correctly and thank you for your presentation you mentioned that the the school year starting that the school's not using that green space there is that correct big you we can't get in but is there not a green space between the old Ball Park the new ball park in the fence it seems bit the same size as it was before cuz it was pushed back but there is Green Space there I'm just they're trying to figure out why the school's not using that green spaces between the two Ball Diamonds well as you can see above oneir of it is cut off oh you can't see there I am uh well if my the thing that the slide I have in front it's back up yeah you can see there's a big piece of it moving now remember there was a second Green Space that everybody was using that was beside it and that's no longer usable at all because it's got all the apparatus from the ball Diamond that's been slid down into it so the deal was we would give up the second Green Space for a bigger Central one and uh now the deal's gone back on and we're not get we're instead of getting a big bigger Green Space we get a smaller one with a fence that runs across the middle of it okay I understand that but you stated that can't use the green space because there's locks on the ball Diamond but there's still green space between the two diamonds that's where I'm confused we were hoping to get something big enough to play a proper game of soccer which was there before and something big enough to play cricket in the future too and all kinds of other things because you just have a central the good Park design you have a a large Central green sword of grass that can be used for all kinds of different things you don't put a permanent fence AC down the middle of it bad Park planning okay thank you okay there no other questions uh Mr Gordon thank you very much my pleasure okay so before we go any further I will ask if there are any other delegations that are to be added councelor Ridge thank you worship through you um I'm uh adding Mary farar or requesting Mary forar be added as a delegation okay move by councelor Ridge seconded by councelor Steven that our procedural bylaw be wave to allow Mary farar to speak to councel with respect to Clause two report number 77 from the with respect to the employment area lands review I will call the vote all those in favor opposed and that's carried any other delegations councilor Glenn uh I'd like to add Martha voser to speak to motion number one okay moveed by Council Glenn seced by councel McLaren uh that we wave our procedural bot to allow Martha boser to appear before Council to speak to New Motion number one all those in favor opposed and that's carried are there any other delegations to add okay uh seeing none then we will at this point I'll invite uh Mary Farrar to speak to council with respect to Clause two from port number 77 the employment um lands area review far thank you so much for the opportunity appreciate it I'll try and be fast here um as many of you know I'm president of the Community Association the friends of Kingston Inner Harbor and I have approximately a thousand people on my mailing list and I'm speaking today um with concerns that have been emailed to me by uh 25 to 30 members of my mailing list who are all over the city of Kingston and the world in fact um so my concern is about the lack of inclusion of Collins Bay as part of the um Land employment possibility and um you know this is a large portion of land pretty Central in Kingston that has facilities and we don't see any reason why this hasn't been included we don't know why the federal government when it recently uh gave away 56 Federal properties to various municipalities for housing why the Collins Bay Area wasn't included and I'm sure staff I mean we really do appreciate the work that staff has done and the reports that have gone into this have all been you know required a huge amount of work but this seems like a gaping hole and in the interests of um open and transparency I have one ask for council tonight when this project uh comes before you to please inquire of Staff what the status is in their negotiations with the federal government about Collins Bay and the potential future inclusion of Collins Bay for housing for affordable housing for Land employment for offices for all of the things that are mentioned in the in the land um in the land report um why aren't we hearing about this why is this shut off I mean I used to work in the prisons I understand Corrections um concerns um it seems to me that they're doing pretty well with their um Downing of drones and if the municipality had all of that land you wouldn't necessarily have to build right beside the wall where somebody could send a drone from their house over over the fence or something like that I mean you could just use a third of the land far away it could be a mix of mid-rises and um and single family homes and offices and um employment opportunities so um again my ask is that I would really like Council to ask staff what is the status of this and can future um locations be added to the land employment locations that are currently there um so I leave that with you thank you how long was I you were like three minutes you're good oh I didn't make it I was hoping I could be one so no problem are there any questions from Council councilor Steve thank you mayor Patterson through you thank you for coming one question I have is have you and your team spoken to our MP's office since we know this is federal land I I haven't got my I lost a hearing aid my cat took it away and I don't have um I don't have hearing aids right now perhaps you could tell me ask question sure so the question uh was have you or your group spoken to the mp uh since it's federal land and it doesn't fedal it's not given by the city so have you spoken to MP garrson um I have spoken to mark garrson but I don't know if staff has I'm assuming staff has I don't know thank you mayor Patterson and I would just like to say if you would like to ask him again please do thank you very much thank you okay so you know other questions thank you very much okay so I will now go home and watch on TV wonderful that this uh video happens thank you okay great thank you okay so we'll now move to our final delegation this evening we'll invite Martha voser to speak to council uh with respect to New Motion number one regarding the cricket field thank you mayor parison and counselors and City staff and I'm here to talk as the past chair of the sdam district Association for the last two and a half years I commend you for what you've done for Sports in Kingston I think it's amazing and I think it's very good that all of this goes forward and that kids are healthy and strong I think that's an amazing part I spent over 40 years with my front net Club Daycare and raising strong healthy kids is a passion of mine but I am disappointed and disheartened very dismayed at the at the possibility of breaking the agreement that the city made with sdam District ass Association the reason I'm upset with it is because this is a Heritage Property and it is a public property that is used by a lot of people the SDA was formed in 1960s we are community of neighbors who aimed to maintain and improve the quality of life built Heritage and the environment in the sdam district we have much to contend with in the cdam district it's now up to 30 some thousand University students Property Standards have have decreased our lives are affected hugely by what happens in our district this park is a huge piece of our heritage it is a huge piece of what we are in syum District now I'm not arguing that there should be a really good um field I'm not arguing about that but the city told us and I met in those meetings in 2022 that this fence would be temporary if it's only $10,000 to build a temporary one then I am sure we can find a way to make that happen in his in his recent book possible William Yuri speaks to three points of conflict resolution firstly you need to go to the balcony you need to look at the big picture who is this affecting and what is it doing it's definitely affecting to Heritage you did not build your field out in the outer parts of Kingston for a very good reason it's an incredibly beautiful city in fact I'm sure we have to thank the city for fixing that Fountain because of your tournament but you came into the downtown core because of the value because of the beauty and because it's a beautiful neighborhood this neighborhood matters the people in the neighborhood matter my father was one of the founding members of the SDA in 1960s he was a counselor for 12 years he was actually one of the men who helped rebuild City Hall put the Portico back on and get the money to renovate he used to be down in the corner the the council chambers I just I understand that hundreds and hundreds of hours go into sports but I have to tell you hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of hours go into caring for this city and for fighting for things it breaks my heart to walk down the street now and not be able to see the Dome of the city up against the sky breaks my heart to see that fence because it's exclusionary the second point after going to the balcony to see the big picture what is the in so so I I'll go back I don't know if for some of the counselors got to read this letter but what is the intention of your vote who will gain and what gain will there be for the city who and what are are we going to serve with a decision to increase the accessibility or to deny the use of this space to only one group secondly we have to build a bridge we have to work together isn't a a temporary fence an option I mean it's like yeah it looks really good now and it's great and we brought in millions of dollars and this is wonderful and now it's as as um Professor Gordon said there's this visible I you don't belong here you can't use this space and I don't think that's acceptable how do we serve both groups I think a temporary fence is possible cordoning off this space for years until such time that that age group can return to the city although I was happy to hear that you've got things happening in in 20125 30 seconds okay and the third side is from exclusion to inclusion there is always a large Horizon there is much to be done it is up to you to contribute some small part to the program of human betterment for all time we need to work together this is our neighborhood I spent decades playing in that Park and in the Cricut field and I'm just a very passionate person about my downtown part of this city okay thank thank you very much are there any questions from Council uh councelor Glen thank you through you thank you so much Martha for explaining uh your passion for it can you speak to your experience of the park what you do there and and others well we had a wonderful huge um musical event before Co um I've seen all kinds of games happen there's all there's there's um like I don't I'm not a sports person I envy the sports people in this room because I'm not one but I'm always walking in that Park and I see lots and lots of people little Parks a little pi setup things happening it's just a multi-use park for a lot of people in the area and we don't have a lot of parks in Sy of District thank you and you mentioned the fountain can you speak to what that fence does to the renovation of the courthouse and uh how that's experienced by others I think it's it's the exclusionary part of it you know I played in that Fountain a lot as a kid I play I ran all around the cricket field we did all kinds of stuff but if there's a lock on something and it's we don't use this then it's an unfortunate way of being in the world I think we need to be more inclusive and we've also got to consider the fact that we have the indigenous group across the street um the um four directions and we have TP mosa on the other side and I see a lot of different groups using that as a as a a place to con to to meet and create circles now I'm not saying they're going to be sitting in the middle of the ball Diamond but it's just the visual of this is ours and you can't come here and that feels unfortunate to me okay are there any other questions from Council wa see none thank you very much thanks okay um so we have no further delegations this evening um we haven't done this for a while but one thing that I could propose to council because I know that most people in the audience and most of the delegations have been focused on New Motion number one with the consent of council we could deal with new motion number one before the other reports is that acceptable all right so what we'll do is we'll just instead of before we get to report number uh 76 that we'll deal with new motion number one okay so with consent uh we have no briefings this evening are there any petitions to present okay seeing none we do have one motion of recognition move by councelor Steven second by councilor Ridge that Kingston City Council recognized the third week of September as consent week recognized by many post-secondary institutions and municipalities across Ontario the timing of consent week has been chosen to highlight that during the first weeks of school there is a significant increase in sexual violence consent is giving permission for something to happen or agreement to do something without threat or coercion consent is also about setting boundaries having the freedom to express those boundaries respecting the boundaries set by others and being able to accept rejection and move on the city of Kingston recognizes the efforts of Queens University to encourage and Foster consent culture and encourages all Kingston residents to do the same all those in favor opposed and that's carried okay so we have no deferred motions so at this point we will now move to New Motion number one uh just a reminder um which we had discussed earlier is that we will now use the voting system that is on escribe uh for recoded votes so moving ahead to New Motion number one uh move by counselor a seconded by counselor shapes whereas the Cricut Field located at 32 baggot Street has been utilized by the community for many years and is part of a municipally designated property under an interal Heritage act and whereas in 22 following engagement with the cdam district Association and Heritage Kingston City Council approved improvements uh to the cricket field including a temporary fence and Gates around the Outfield to support a national championship tournament in Kingston whereas the temporary fence around the Outfield was intended to be removed post tournament based on direction from city council whereas some members of the community have shared concerns about the removal of the temporary fence as they see value in its retention for future uses including potential future events and whereas city council wants to ensure that it maximizes the taxpayers investments in community infrastructure therefore be resolved the city council direct staff to consult with the cdam district Association and the Kingston Heritage properties committee to identify options that could possibly result in an event-based or permanent Outfield fence at Cricket field either through use of the existing temporary fence or a new fence and the council direct staff to consider options for reuse or relocation of the temporary Outfield fence should it not remain at cricet field to maximize taxpayers investment and the council direct staff to leave the temporary Outfield fence at Cricut field until staff report back with options in early 2025 cancor Amos you have the floor thank you m Patterson through you um I'd ask staff if they could put up the first slide for me I'd appreciate it thank you so in in order for one I want to say thank you to all the groups that are presented today uh or tonight it um clearly passion uh is coming to the Forefront through all of this one of my biggest concern concerns [Music] when a facility like this is made or or brought together um obviously some of it is the dollar figure and when you have a a facility that's over a million dollars to construct 1,00 staff hours um from multiple departments we now have a state-of-the-art facility for our youth to enjoy it and it it created the opportunity for hus to host the Canadian Little League championships without this fence it would not be a proper ball field it would be the same as a hockey rink with no boards or a soccer field with no goal posts it's just part of a proper field and in this case it's baseball slide two please now miss Lambert from Kingston tourism uh gave a very thorough presentation on what this ball Diamond did do for us how much it generated for us and the potential for what it can do moving forward and you can see from well the list of tournaments that she brought forward but the one I want to highlight the most is the Little League Ontario is interested in hosting um the first girls little league provincial tournament in the region it can't be done anywhere else and it's because of this field we can grow to be multiple events annually in the cricet field to be it can begin to bridge the gender gap and little league youth baseball and that's huge traditionally when you think of baseball you think of boys and when you start to think Hardball and you think women female youth moving forward that's an awesome Prospect for us as a city and that's where we need to move forward for us to be able to host another National Championship the reason we're even being considered for this national championship and to be shortlisted is because of this field u3 and I'm assuming it's seven more seven more uh teams with our host team hosting uh the tournament itself the economic engine is huge for us sport tourism is huge for our region we have the ball field uh it can open the gateway to so many benefits to our youth and our community Leisure tourism is down this past year for our city sport tourism especially this tournament filled our hotels and when I say filled it wasn't 90% 80% it filled for 10 days it filled our hotels it filled our restaurants added to our tour trolley as you can see the pictures that were up toured all of our museums as a city we had an opportunity we moved forward with it and it proved to be a success I'm going to keep this short there a number of presentations have already been uh done on this so I ask for your support for this review to have all groups come together to hope we find a solution for this ball field I think it's a reasonable request I was not there 5 years ago uh when this was decided but here we are we've got a great ball field that is nationally recognized and is creating opportunities for us as a city I ask for your your your support on this motion thank you okay thank you cancer channy hi U my question would be to staff about this um so if this motion were to go through um could the locks be unlocked or the gates removed um as a possibility while the discussions and and uh go through oh Mr Bell go ahead yes thank you um through you Mr Mayor uh yeah well we staff and Engineering will work with Public Works um tomorrow and talk about the removal locks so it could be open up for for General use oh thank you so then technically like this community and the school could use the space while we're continuing to discuss so um realize this motion is just to discuss the fate of the fence and it could end up being where it's a permanent fence or a temporary fence or no fence at all in the end I mean so but I think it's worth exploring to see what the community needs are especially with the impact with uh tourism and Sport and the need for all the growth that's happening there so I think we just need to reevaluate what the impact is going to be and what the need is so I think I'll I'll be supporting this motion um because this is things we need to know and we really need to discuss this thanks thank you anybody else on New Motion number one councilor Glenn thank you and through you um as you can well imagine I'm not supportive of this motion from the perspective that we're going back on what was agreed upon there was a lengthy consultation process here with the SDA and the fences were supposed to come down as has been pointed out multiple times it's only the Outfield fence that's coming down um I requested a copy of the original report and it was clearly outlined in that Heritage report that went to council so the Heritage report was September 21st of 202 2 and it went to the October 4th 2022 meeting of council and in there that was the agreement that and the outside track um this was done because this is an inclusive Park we've already heard at previous meetings that our Parks aren't very inclusive and now we're going to put up a fence and make them less inclusive and you know people keep going back and forth about well what's actually happening out there and I think we've heard from the neighborhood what happens there there're the people who live there they're the people who use it regularly and I see these fences as very much like the barriers we put up when we do a parade or when we hold another event in a park even Canada day we we put up barriers we put up tents we put up things and then we take them down because the event over because we go back to the other things we do and what we were told was that this was going to be for a tournament now I was always happy to have discussions but not when we're going back on something like this not when it's been negotiated come and have a discussion in good faith this is not good faith to have a a neighborhood association work with you for months and then to turn around and say hey thanks but no thanks we're going to go back on what we we decided we' do as to the part about tournaments we want a tournament with nothing in place and we've heard that the kids can continue to play they can play effectively kids have played on these fields for years so they'll still be able to come out and play and we're still going to be in a position where tournaments are possible we don't see tournaments every day or even every year most of the time if you ask most cities you'll find that they look to get midsized or smaller tournaments every second year large tournaments potentially every five because they rotate around municipalities that's part of the economic development piece and it's part of ensuring inclusivity of the entire Province or country for the sport uh everybody who came today knew what had been talked about so I'm hoping that you will give consideration for respect to the community because what we're talking about isn't simply offense it's about the things that we actually value in this community so what is it that we value do we value our constituents and their everyday lived experience I hope we do because that's what they're talking about or do we simply value one particular sport above all others in a particular place there were opportunities to have put this in another location but as it's been mentioned it was put in city park because city park is a beautiful Park and it's beautiful because of all the work that's been done generation after generation to care for the space to ensure that nothing else got built there so with respect to that I think we need to honor the agreement we had it doesn't mean a discussion still can't be had but other options have been made available other options were discussed um it's very likely we'll be able to pull a lot out of the plans and I'm going to ask that question staff do we still have all the uh potential plans available uh Mr uh thank you three and sorry counselor but plans available related to the conversations that took place in regards to this this field yes certainly we we have the the public engagement in the process that took place I'm not sure we have every single draft inv verion but we can we can pull up the the concept development and the conversations for sure um and the concessions and how we got to this point uh as indicated by um by um Professor Gordon you know things got moved around and and space got created to create as open of a space as possible so we would certainly bring those back to the table um if this motion's approved as part of those conversations with the associations okay but suffice to say there were multiple plans developed and uh lots of conversation about what this could be and what it could look like that's already occurred uh yeah that's correct and that that's our approach with our our um our public engagement through our Park development process at this location or other locations whether it's a revitalization project or a new park um so they start in the concept stage and conversations happen um until the shovels in the ground and the the facility is open and enjoyed okay thank you and so I think the last point that I'm going to um make here is that I asked about how long baseball is played what their season is and it's roughly four four and a half months um there's 12 months in a year and so we're sectioning off a large portion with his fence um for that play and for play for little league not for any other level of sport so I hope he'll give consideration to uh a bit of respect for the community that lives here um and the values that we all purport to believe in which is inclusivity multi use um and also that we do have some respect for the Heritage considerations that this District so values thank you okay uh next on my list is councelor rof thank you mayor Patterson um I would just correct my colleague here the baseball is used for about six or even closer seven months I believe so I think it's important to be clear though I do hear my and I respect uh that the the difficulty um that kind of arises here I amum I really uh I'm a baseball guy I love baseball and it's in my in my heart and um so right from the beginning I was hoping um having had the privilege mayor Patterson of giving the greetings on your behalf it was really really an honor to be there and to to experience what I did there and get that feel of that uh that that excitement that you know you get from baseball so um and and it's it is fantastic um so uh yeah I'm I'm a bit torn on this one because um I was there uh in November 22 too I didn't realize for myself the depth of the um depth of the passion on both sides and um so and I you know um I think there is some respect required here uh from from both sides because uh it kind of does remind me a bit of the Field of Dreams okay I I I think we all know that movie and I I could have seen that movie many times over it was a good one because it does something to you it changes you and so that's kind of what we're we're seeing here I think uh in my heart I I see that and um I everyone who spoke spoke so well and um all along um I wanted to I want to support the baseball dream here uh and um because Kingston's a special town and has so many great Sports and um I will say that M boser really did touch my heart as well because she grew up there as well but um I didn't know okay I didn't know that the the field um was locked okay that that bothers me uh bothers me a lot and I also know from engineering they're going we don't want to unlock it because we want to preserve it in that sense so we understand the rationale right why why we're locking it because we want to protect it kind of and I and I get that but I probably um don't don't like it I wanted to ask staff mayor Patterson a quick question about was there another because my kids played ball I know how rare it is to find a good ball field and that's no criticism on Sports and wreck but uh ball fields need to be in a particular shape to prevent injury was there another field mayor Patterson that was close that um if I think about it could it be somewhere else I want to ask that where could it be Mr Poo uh thank you and through you um I I guess we'd have to consider that through the the application process uh counselor certainly we have similar size ball diamonds um my colleague nanor provided some information that included veterans Ron Laval as other locations where the field size could exist there would be other improvements that would be required in order to accommodate the needs of a an event like this um improve dugouts seating that type of uh uh amend and we have other softball diamonds as well that that are similar size but not not not for the same type of event that just happened this past summer so we we do have a number of amenities that are similar uh certainly not in the the same location and and to the standard that this this field currently is at yes okay that helps me it's not clear but um I do think uh having been there and what everyone sees here tonight was we something special was done there so my hats off and all our hats off too staff and and the and building something pretty special there um I wanted to um I didn't know either mayor Patterson that it is possible I think it is possible to take the fence down and do temporary uh we heard someone offering a thousand I think we could Community raise $10,000 quicker than a CAC and Wink's eye really you know we could do that really quick it weighs $10,000 so and if you ever seen a cat wink its ey it's very quick so we could do that and solve a lot of problems so that's kind of what I wanted to to bring to the table um the reason I want to bring up an amendment is for so that we do the hard work tonight and think about the possibility of just changing uh direct staff to leave the temp uh to to remove the temporary uh fence at Cricut field um until staff at the end of the season at the end of this season so we have it for the whole season and because I think think the part I hear it is about respect and I think the baseball Community should recognize that let's respect the Deep history the the Deep connection of um I'll give my rationale later so that's I'd like to have an amendment um mayor Patterson that the The Outfield fence that's there be removed at the end of the year and um that the dialogue happens Mrs osber did an excellent job talking about restorative conversation and how you do that that is how you do it is you you show that you will engage and so I'm talking too much but go ahead that's what I'd like to see uh okay amendment to remove mam C can I see from moment okay so so my proposal Council St I I don't we don't have an amendment in writing so here's what I'm going to suggest that when we do the vote on New Motion one that we can do one vote on every paragraph except for the last one and then we can do a SE SE paragraph or is we do a separate vote on the last part okay sorry yeah okay so we'll just do a separation okay I think that's that's fair so we can yeah L the amendment is just dealing with the last Clause so effectively the the cleanest way to do this is just to have two separate votes so we'll just do a separate vote on that last clause and then go from there sorry I guess this is a point order um for those new in the room I do that a lot you'll get used to that I do points of order so for clarification the last Clause are we amending it or are we voting it up and down because if it's an amendment needs to be seconded and we need to separately so that that's a good point Madam cler can I see you one more time well thanks okay I want to get it right for those visiting procedural questions are very common in City because we have to do things right because these are sort of Legally binding directives that we're giving to staff we appreciate your patience thank you okay um thank you so counc too you do raise a good point that I I believe what councilor osterhoff had suggested is an amendment that would remove the fence at the end of the season so voting against that Clause would be different presumably if that last paragraph to fail then the director to staff would be to remove the fence immediately so given that it's fair councilor osterhoff that if that is your intention it does need to be an amendment okay so um what I would propose it's 8:14 take a 10-minute break give you a chance to craft the wording for that Amendment and then we will uh discuss thank you we'll reconvene at 824 e e e e e e for e e e e e e e e e for for e e okay folks it is uh now 8:25 so I'll ask if uh counselors can grab their seats please okay so my understanding is that we do now have an amendment was moved by councel ro second by osanic uh that new motion number one be amended to delete and replace the third recommend Clause with the following that um Council direct staff to remove the temporary Outfield fence at the cricket field at the end of the 2024 baseball season and the staff report back with options in early 2025 councelor osterhoff this is your Amendment uh you have the floor yes thank you mayor Patterson so thanks to my secondary for this and I think we all probably know where I'm suggesting we go and um again I'll give Mr VOS for the credit um though I've been involved in restorative conversations in the past even in my work um so as a counselor a different times and this is an opportunity for us to counsel just to take a moment to think about it I know you might want to say no let's go with it I don't think it disrespects my colleague who I have given commendations of the motion from the beginning because I was drawn to it because of my passion for the game but miss bosford spoke about building a bridge this is an opportunity for us to build a bridge and and have that discussion so we can serve both groups um in my mind a temporary fence is a good option and um she mentioned about working together this is how we demonstrate that we can do that and so it does change my position a little bit but a locked field doesn't do it for me that's that's that's exclusionary we just came up last council with an amazing you know inclusive parks and we we celebrate that and I do today but this this this seems to go against that uh mentality really of uh inclusiveness so and I think it's really important to hear each other and the one I really hear as well mayor Patterson is about uh the history of that amazing area the years that have gone by how it was used by generation of children and adults and and so uh I think it's in a sense of uh respecting the past and past decisions and how we can uh I think it actually I think staff can get this we can do this well and right because we see we see the image of it in the field that we have and I believe that we can now complete the picture where we can have have our cake and eat it too that we're the uh and um let's accomplish that uh together and I'm asking for your support thank you okay so we are only speaking right now to the amendment is there anybody else that we to speak to the amendment councelor shapes thank you um well first I'm going to touch on the money problem this overall motion is going to public engagement and we're going to see what happens so if it continues if we take the fence down now and then the engagement goes to put it back up then we're spending money to put the fence back that was already there and that's I sort of have an issue that aspect the other concern we've brought up through here and it's been noted is the gates are locked which I think most of us were somewhat unaware of that so I'm not I know staff was commented but do we have any further Direction on that in regards to if the Lock's coming off so it's more accessible because that seems to be a main touching Point okay so I do believe that staff actually answered that question but just because some people obviously didn't catch it can I just ask staff to weigh in on that one more time Mr fobo that's correct and through you um your honors staff will be working with PA Works to have the blocks removed tomorrow I'm not aware of any major events that are coming up on the fields we want to make sure that there's time for them to prep if there are but um the full intention is to unlock the gates and and let people use it when it's not booked okay so locks will not be an issue as of tomorrow um the other thing I'm going to note I was going to say it on the other motion the original motion we've had historical issues with certain parks with vehicles being driven through it especially on the East End soccer fields and a few others causing thousands of dollars of damage we just built this park this ball field and that outside fence will help prevent that so Gates can be opened so people have access to but Vehicles won't be able to access it and drive through and tear it all up and spending even more money trying to fix it up so unfortunately at this point in time I can't support the amendment uh cancer TOA thank you mayor parison through you a question question for staff is the end of the 2024 baseball season uh what do you interpret that date as being M through you Mr Mayor I believe that it is the um end of September um or it could we've just made a change to that I apologize it could be the mid of October sorry about that October 15th okay so I'm comfortable leaving up the fencing and I'll have more to say when we get back to the original motion um I'm going to vote against this right now uh because I think that there's additional utility we could use for the park and just speaking to the amendment I think that's too soon because we are the original Amendment the original motion is about going back into debate having further discussion so I'm going to vote against this right now and then we can go back to the main motion I'll more to say that thank you okay anybody else on the amendment counc Glenn thank you and through you uh so first thank you very much to my colleague for bringing this amendment and for understanding uh the the issue that I raised about respect because I think it's a really critical one we can have a lot of discussions about things but if you want to have a good discussion it has to start with that foundation and right now by leaving this fence up when the intent was to take it down is showing a measure of disrespect for the community that fully engaged on this topic so I understand that people are concerned about the cost but when we weigh the cost of taking this fence down and potentially putting it back up um we're weighing it against the good faith and the trust that our constituents put in us to honor the things that we do and to work with them um with that open transparency so I think you know it calls into question our integrity to some degree to go back on things like this yes it was a great tournament and I think everybody agreed on that so um I I appreciate councilor osterhoff bringing this forward I will vote for this amendment because I think it honors the original intent and um I fully intend to uh to continue to do that on behalf of my constituents uh thank you um dep mayor H will you take the chair I do and recognize you thank you so I strongly disagree with the assertion that leaving the fence is an active disrespect we are a council that has to consider the needs of the community as a whole we've talked about being inclusive inclusive means that everyone matters regardless of where you live in this community we are trying to do the hard work of balancing different interests and frankly when we get back to the main motion that's basically going to be my argument is kind of remind everyone what's in front of us is really just to see if we can work out something that balances the interest in front of us but right now I'm just speaking to the amendment given the fact that by the end of the baseball season we're basically heading into winter and a lot of any other sports or what could be used in that field is basically unusable anyways until the spring it seems to me it makes sense just leave the field up and then we will have those consultations and then we can decide what to do in 2025 everyone matters we want to hear from everyone yes there are residents in the neighborhood that have been affected but you cannot discount the fact that this field has captured the imagination of our community I have heard from countless people baseball lovers and non-baseball lovers about how amazing this field is and we also need to respect them we want to respect the neighborhood but we need to respect everybody and because of my concern that now this amendment has been characterized as somehow an act of disrespect for that reason I am asking Council to vote against the amendment so that we can have a truly Level Playing Field we can have everybody involved in these discussions you like that didn't you thank you very much thank you Deputy Mayor can I have the chair back yes I return to you and and and you want to speak as well okay I'll put you on the speaker list next on my list is councelor Amos thank for Patterson and through you um I appreciate everyone's comments on this um and and councelor osterhoff I appreciate you you bringing this motion forward uh I will not be voting for this and some of the main reasons obviously a lot of people talked about my biggest concern is that staff put a lot of time our contractor put a lot of time in bringing this field up to a state-of-the-art facility ready for national championships we take that fence down over the wintertime councelor shave has already mentioned possibility of vehicles coming on there and Wrecking the turf anything can happen over the wintertime there's no harm in leaving that that fence up to keep that field in the state it's in staff has already agreed the locks are coming off and I believe councelor osterhoff that was one of your biggest concerns I get that my concern as well fully recognize that glad the locks are coming off that being said the field needs to stay in its current state I want to remind staff and councel we are bidding on another multi-million doll tournament coming to this city that Fe field has to stay in its current state I can't support this motion thanks okay next is cancer son thank you your worship and through you listening to both parties my colleagues very patiently and I was not thinking to say anything but with your comments your worship is encourag me to say a few words um I understand from the both parties the negotiation about this temporary fence in the first place was poor negotiation planning to build the Baseball Field is maybe was poor decision poor planning but regardless of those poor planning and poor negotiation as the first place we talking about the community we are talking about the togetherness I respect the seram community District Association and the people who speak there is a heart touching story and how they use that field but we keep for forgetting from the both side that the both groups are our community they're both group are kingstonian we just keep saying the league people the baseball people and the neighborhood living in the the district we shouldn't talk sitting on the seat on on on the house sh like dividing the community we should talk together it was poor negotiation it was poor designing it was a poor decision in the beginning I accept that I recognize that but when we talk about the cam District neighborhood who use that part claim that is their Heritage that's their part of their life but these young people sitting here and the the community members sitting here they're also part of your city the part of our community so who should we include I am in the position and thank you for both group to put me in this position to think who is right and who is wrong both of you are my people are my kingstonians it's my community so I am very sad to hear that from both side to put us all in this position where we have to decide okay you are right and you are wrong you deserve more and they deserve less but despite of that we shouldn't have such situation and I apologize uh anyone who feel that that Deion or negotiation in the first place was poorly made you know we shouldn't have that kind of uh decision we shouldn't say it's temporary and we shouldn't say that okay well you know we're going to let you play this year but n and then put million dollar up there and build the state of the art facility and promising the one one group okay we're going to tear it down after the tournament that was not the right thing and I recognize that but but having said that I think we are at the point right now we are opening up the door for more engagement more discussion and I'm the favor of to leave the fence up there and let's discuss up to the next year so they have tournament if Community decide the king sonian decide that they do not need the fence I will respect and I will vote for it and if they say no that's okay to have it the both Community can you know work together and use inclusively you know I will word for that but at this point I think the keeping the fence up there is more important than tearing it down temporarily again and go back and put it so I can support this motion okay uh next on my list is uh councelor Steven thank you mayor patteron through you so I can understand the feeling of disappointment for some community members in cinm District because these expectations were set back in 202 2022 and these expectations are not being met so those were those conversations that were had back then but I think it's really important as well to recognize that it's 2024 and the context has actually changed so back when those conversations were happening we didn't know what we know now and we didn't even have the field when those conversations were happening it was all theoretical at that time so I think that given we're in a new place right now I think it's entirely reasonable that we're going to hopefully direct staff to go away and have these conversations but in the meantime to this amendment leaving it in place is the only thing that makes sense to me taking it down letting the field get wrecked over the winter and anyone who's had anyone walk on any kind of yard through the winter time I you know I've seen schoolyards you should see them in the spring they are an absolute disaster so we need to protect it to councilor am's point and also it seems completely absurd to spend the money to take the field the fence down to then maybe put like it's it's an absolute waste of money to do that leave it where it is so I'm opposed to this amendment thanks okay Council clar thank you I was going to ask these questions during the main motion but it seems appropriate now can we get some fact checks um one of the delegations pointed to a map of the uh field with a red rectangle showing where a possible soccer field that was played before covid was is that an accurate thing because it looked like the fence was going through about a third of the of that football or sorry that soccer field is it true that there was soccer being played prior to this uh this fence being put up and is that picture accurate that shows that the fence would actually be in where the um soccer field would have been or where people would play soccer Mr Po thank you through you um I don't know the dimensions counselor of the field of m still there certainly we have a mini soccer field in the southwest corner of the existing City Park the open space would permit Open soccer from a just a pylons on the field as they were described um we have shown some information that it's not large enough to accommodate say a full-size Cricket field um as the name suggests so you know it it is it wouldn't accommodate a full-size soccer but sorry did you say would or wouldn't I'm sorry did you say sorry it would not accommodate it a fullsize soccer pitch in that space sorry that's with the fence or without the fence uh with the fence could it happen without the fence uh certainly it could have we could fit a fullsize soccer field in that space space utilizing um the ball diamond in the northeast corner and the existing um new ball Diamond that was constructed if there were no fences yes a full-size soccer field would fit in this space okay um what about a football field so K mlar I just want to pause for a moment so the amendment is talking about what to do between the end of the baseball season and early 2025 yes so I just soccer and football are played by the school right in that area and they may need that space which is where that is leading between November and and March soccer starts I believe in November football starts in September I'm just just trying to bring you back to the amendment just to clarify that's fine Mr Po yeah so this space was never a bookable rectangular field for soccer or football there certainly there's informal uses that take place um and you know it's certainly the recommendation to ensure that you have access to that space from a user group is that you book a City Field either rectangular or a ball Diamond even as a school user group and certainly I know our Public Works teams on the call or on on the meeting tonight that want to ensure that our rectangular spaces in our bookable fields are not utilized by other groups so that they can be then used for those bookable spaces Memorial center I think is another good example of that in the in the downtown area where a number of spaces coexist um and they bookable spaces but there is a small soccer field in City Field city park to the South but it's not a full-size field in the past it was claimed that um sdam School used that area is that was that true in the past and um have they indicated any indication that they may want to use that space without the fence uh through you Mr Mayor I'm not aware of that I would need some support from director elgersma um in terms of the bookings within our existing facilities whether Sports fields or otherwise or director s you to comment on the Public Schools current bookings with the city of Kingston not only current past as in were they doing it were they excluded as a result of this fence it it wasn't it wasn't a bookable space and certainly they likely go down at recess and utilize that space like a number of our schools I think do commissioner Campell oh thank you and through you um happy to address that question it's our understanding that the school may be using it informally um as director fwell just indicated but we don't have a current agreement with the school to allow them you know unfettered use of that field for the reason um for school recreational thank you and we also heard um through an email that it was 20,000 for um temporary fencing we heard from one of the delegations that they they priced it at 10,000 is the difference the Labor uh Mr for you um without seeing the the the quotes I can't comment on that but sorry I see um yeah Mr Ensworth Al just hand up Mr hsith go ahead thanks Luke through you Mr chair um the temporary fencing that's installed in the current facility to um the untrained eye looks like regular chainlink fence um with u you know the posts going to the ground so forth and so on required archaeological approval and all those the like um alternate temporary fences that uh Professor Gordon referred to costing less than that uh would would be made of different materials and that's the fundamental difference uh between what's on the field now that's essentially a um traditional construction material just installed um in a temporary way versus um event fencing which is what I believe Professor Gordon was more referring to could a tournament be used or be done with event fencing rather than the current temporary fencing so Council McLaren this relates to the amendment yes because like because I can't ask later if the amendment passes this is the Crux of the motion it's in this particular motion that is be this particular line in the um so I agree I agree that it's a valid line of questioning on the main motion regardless of whether the amendment passes or not but talking about the details of the fencing in my view I don't understand how that applies to the amendment that's on the floor so you're welcome I I'll certainly entertain more of these questions once we get back to the main motion either way Sor I say that again so the line of questioning about understanding the different options with Defence is absolutely valid for the main motion but I don't I don't believe that this is relevant to the amendment itself which is on the floor I'm simply trying to keep everybody around the table just steered to the amendment first and then we'll be back to the main motion where you'll have another chance to speak and ask those questions okay okay I'll wait for the rest then okay next on my list for the amendment oh actually councelor bom I saw your hand up did you want to speak to the amendment no okay is there anybody else that wishes to speak to the amendment not councelor oof you have the last word yeah thank you mayor Patterson and uh thanks for the good discussion everyone and uh I just wanted to ask one question if I could um was there not an inclusion in the budget to have the fence removed if it was included in the original understanding Mr F yes thank you and through you Mr Mayor yes the current capital budget includes the cost to remove the fence thank you I just wanted to say that I think we need to um know what's important here and I believe it's important because of what we heard from those who were there in the discussion um and uh early on the understanding the agreement and I think that that is more important and the most important thing that we recognize that there was a trust there there was there was an understanding and for those that weren't there and even those who uh as a a voting person in 2022 I did not realize the depth of the discussion I don't recall that so I'm asking for us to show that kind of Goodwill and I I think that I think that even the I believe the basgall community can understand that this is not pitting the one side of Kingston to the other side but this is one side coming in to a deep tradition and there you know what we we I've done enough in the in in the heritage of pushing back at different times I think this is a time to embrace that and to engage in discussion to complete what was planned and then have a good discussion over the winter so I'm asking for your support because good discussions start with trust thank you okay so we're going to call the vote on the amendment so just so everyone's following this is a vote whether or not to replace the last Clause of the motion and then we will continue debate on the motion as is um if everyone has their escribe open the vote is now open for the amendment okay mayor Patterson I'm going to just cancel and reopen the vote and we'll ask people to please try again okay we tried so we'll do a hand vote so on the motion to amend all those in favor opposed and that loses by a vote of four to9 councelor osanic osterhoff McLaren and Glenn uh in the minority okay so we are back to the main motion as not amended um and next on my list is uh councelor tozo thank you mayor patter through you it looks like I'm next up at bat there's going to be a lot of these puns so I'd ask you just maintain um first of all the legal agreement uh the agreement with the syum association is this legally binding for the city hello I'm Sorry Miss Morley that's a question thank you through your worship there is no formal legal agreement between the the city and the cdam district Association the city is the owner of the property I understand that it was a condition of the Heritage approval that the fence be removed okay thank you let's sort of clarify what this motion is about where it's about fencing and it's about to go back talk to the synd association talk to Heritage leave the fence up until we all come to some sort of major agreement and then maybe we'll decide on what we're going to do going forward um we are here to talk and we want to make sure everybody can live with something that's one thing I've learned about being a counselor is we don't often don't make everybody happy but we try to make it so that people can live with it right everybody walks away a little happy little unhappy we found a good public policy and that's I think what we're looking for another thing I want to address is that about Heritage and I've seen that term thrown around since I've been elected a counselor Heritage isn't shackles it doesn't bind the present we acknowledge heritage we honor it and we work with it as part of what an amazing City that we are part of Kingston is were Heritage and Innovation meet it's a great slogan you guys can use it if you want and staff I hear see it when we walk into our town or driveing into the town it's a great slogan I've heard from constituents in Kings Court and R Heights whose kids use the field and as was written by Warren canella from Field of Dreams if you build it it's actually called shulu Jo it's a good book recommend you read it um if you build it they will come we built it and they came second baseball reference um the Little League diamonds came the little leagues came and that's amazing I don't think this motion is out of left field I've seen motions strike out I've seen motions bunted down with deferrals councilor Amos so point of order that's too many baseball puns in one sentence I understand that I will say I think that what we are asking staff to do do is go back talk to everybody report back leave it up until we come to a decision that cost is absolutely outrageous to take it down and put it back up I'm fine with the motion that we have supported here I think this motion is a home run thank you okay uh thank you councel toen next is cancer bone thank you here wor shipping through you uh just listening to everything I sometimes wonder if uh people at home are watching us wondering why we're spending so many hours debating a temporary fence and questioning the more important things out there like people who are facing an affordability with housing uh lack of access to food addictions and Mental Health crisis and we've just spent two hours talking offence that were to come down today or tomorrow likely not not affect the outcome of any sporting event um so far I've heard tonight a lot of justification about it's visually not appealing um well it's hard to say this but I'm going to say it you don't own a you just you don't own a you so it's something where um coun too did steal my line I had it prepped and everything but yeah we did build it and they did come and that is something where it was of national importance I have met over the many years that I've been on council with so many sports tourism Advocates with so many people who play sports and one of the most difficult things they say is having ready built to play facilities to post National and um and Regional level events it's not about well can you build it if if we were to come or if you were to get them it's do you have it is it ready to go because that's what we're looking for and that's what's going to make our short list so with this currently as it is we make that short list we will get more interest from this we did host a very successful National event the economic impact of that um obviously plays huge dividends beyond that we're facing an obesity uh epidemic amongst children the likes of which we've never seen and the one main thing is get them out there get them active find a sport any sport and just get them motivated and basically get them addicted to some type of sport in a healthy way to get them you know off of video games and off the TV so in the grand scheme of things you know we we we know that the gate should be unlocked I think that's a no-brainer I think that's something where you know let's even just consider removing the gates alt together let's let's increase the open field of access to this in the grand scheme of things um there's lots of open space there one of the things that seemed to come through unfortunately loud and clear from some of the delegations that were against this was it was not about the benefits of it it was about what was being taken away from them so if we take the gates out we're no longer really taking away from anything and it was kind of like having a huge open space and then fencing off a portion of it for a specific type of play and somebody saw that as well we're losing something and it's like well what about the 80% of of all that well it's not about that it's about what we're losing over here and I think that that is really the wrong way and it's a very small way of looking at this is is don't look at what you're losing look at what you're G look at the passion that went into this the countless volunteer hours the national level event that we hosted the future events that we can host and the fact that realistically I think we've all supported in the past a motion that simply says go out and have more talks about this don't make any knee-jerk reactions right now let's just continue the discourse and at the end of the day that's literally all this is asking I don't see any hidden agenda in here if the community decides a year from now to tear this down you know um fence post by fence post I think we're all going to go okay well the community decided that but in the meantime there's no harm in leaving it up there's been a lot of effort put into this and I think that this is to kudos to counselor Amos this is a common sense let's have a discussion path forward before we bring in the bulldozers and I think I just don't understand where the controversy is around is not really asking for anything out left field to quote counselor too and numerous other baseball Fanatics throughout the years but this is just a common sense let's continue the discourse it's not you know mayor Patterson said it's not really costing us anything to lead this up it's not taking anything away to just have this conversation and we've all supported those motions in the past so I don't see why this shouldn't go forward I get a vote in favor of it thanks Council your most for bringing cheers okay thank you next is cancer oranic thank you your worship uh through you I really wish that this um little Le baseball diamond was at some other park because then we wouldn't be having this discussion if it was at Woodbine Park or one of the others you know um I was going to support this motion up until I found out that we had an agreement with you know sdnm District Association in 2022 to bring down the fence and to me that changed everything I even thought back then that it was just a verbal agreement it was just tonight that I found out it was actually written in the Heritage report like to me that makes it very formal and you know it was a definite decision and an agreement back in 2022 and I think that our integrity as a council is kind on the line here tonight you know like um if we vote for this motion and direct staff to have discussions I kind of think that we're setting staff up for failure right because we can see tonight that the baseball people and I have nothing against baseball but the baseball players they want the fence to remain and then the CDM District Association they want the fence to come down so how's staff supposed to negotiate with that and I think it comes down to back in 2022 we have it in the Heritage committee report that this temporary fence would come down at the end and yep if we do get the um next year's championships we can put the fence back up but like what's the saying to our public to negotiate with city council with City staff you know it's like what's the point because the next Council or even the next year here we could all change our mind again as soon as the motion you know is finished and that one year laps we could change our mind and I don't know we have like it's trust at stare tonight so I was going to support it until I found out that we had that commitment to cdnim District I remember the motion from 2022 I remember we put all the money towards the World Championships that we had and it was very successful what I didn't realize at the time was that the fence was coming down and now it's been pointed out to me and so I can't support the motion sorry thank you Council Rich okay thank you your worship and through you so this has been a very uh fullsome discussion and I I really do appreciate everybody sharing their opinions and perspectives on this um there's a lot of things that have been mentioned already that I was planning on mentioning um you know we talked about the economic activity uh we have uh downtown businesses have indicated that you know sales have been down 10 to 15% uh in comparison to the previous year and that we we it's great to have people here visiting playing sports and and bringing uh increased economic activity we can talk about the costs of removing the fence and putting them back up which seems to be to me to be uh mismanaging well respected taxpayer dollars um but I want to talk about sports because I used to play a lot of them I was never very good at them though uh but I still tried and I think that something that's being missed here except for maybe unintentionally through counselor too's terrible puns uh is that sports sports especially when you're a child sports are gold and their gold in a way that a lot of people it's hard to it's hard to to say out loud uh so I found because I found a quote from Billy Jean King who's a tennis player sorry I look for a baseball player but I couldn't find one sports teaches you character it teaches you to play by the rules it teaches you to know what it feels like to win and lose it teaches you about life and I think that we're all looking to strategically increase uh recreational activities for youth we can point to January of this year when we were discussing the Icelandic model encouraging youths to participate in recreational activities including Sports to reduce opioid Addiction in youths and children um but more fullsome than that it brings communities to life and it builds character and I want to be part of a council that's encouraging that so I am in favor of this motion and hope everybody else supports it thank you so much so [Music] much okay thank you um Deputy Mayor would you take the chair yes I recogniz you thank you so there's been Lots that's been said on this issue so I'm going to keep my comments pretty brief Council has the right to change its mind Council has changed their minds on many things over the years Council used to think that the Wellington Street Extension was absolutely something we were going to do and we told everyone we were going to do it and then you know what new information came forward new people sitting around the council table and you know what council changed its mind this happens all the time the reason is that we're talking about public space it belongs to everyone in our community and so when new information comes forward or new members of our community come forward with a different view then it's okay to engage and say okay all right this is public space what's the best way to use that public space I'll be honest with you I like this motion just because it's not drawing conclusions it's just saying hey you know what there's a lot of people that have come forward uh and they have this View and so we want to respect that view and so let's bring everyone together let's see if we can work at a compromise if you vote against this motion you're saying we don't even want to have those conversations ations to see if we can work out a compromise I don't know what the end result of this is going to be but I think it's incumbent on us as Council to listen to everyone in our community to recognize that there are different viewpoints and let's find a forum where we can have that discussion and see if we can work something out at the end of the day right that's our responsibility that's why this city doesn't run on autopilot and we just go with whatever was decided years before because things change councilor Steven said it well sometimes circum has Chang the context is different okay so then we need to adapt to that it's respectful right everyone matters here but let's have that conversation and let's see what options we can come up with and you know what I I actually don't underestimate the abilities of our staff to work out some sort of Creative Solutions at the end of the day we'll see what options come forward and then we can decide from there but I'm asking Council to support this just because regardless of what your feelings are on this let's have the conversation I think we owe that to our community thank you you attend to you uh thank you uh next on my list is ccor shes thank you first I want to thank you as the empire for for calling out our our our fellow counselor for four foul puns so that's the first thing I'm going to say um I always comment about Council make changing from preval council's decisions but I think you you said it quite well um do we have a photo of past before and after pictures of the field CU I know one thing we that was just brought up was the field space and availability of field space so I guess the one before and the one after is the new one but from what I can sort of see baly uh the space between the two Ball Diamonds the space is relatively the same so I do believe there is sufficient space at this current time until we the staff can come back with report that any individual within the area including the school I'm not sure if the whole school comes out or not is able to use that green space in that be time not to mention across the street there's City Park which also mentioned they have a mini soccer field there as well with post there's there was not and never has been any Soccer Post at that field it was just a makeshift Circle or rectangular uh to make a point as to where they were and one the speakers mentioned they use pylons so it can be adjusted I know I played off the cop Sports we just gather in the field we use pylons B book uh backpacks or coats so um the field still usable um my understanding if Stafa want to correct me is this application came up quickly and I think the public engagement wasn't g wasn't wasn't given the full time it needed and I think with this motion it gives that time things have settled down and we can discuss different issues more things have come up and maybe there's a better solution between keeping the fence and taking it down something in between which I think with these further discussions can come up so sta makes presentations and maybe there's actually a nice Common Ground between both parties that that's what engagements for in public in in consultation so we we will not find that out if we don't vote for this motion because we won't know what those decisions are let I say let it go through the process keep the fence up at this period of time also it secures safety issues um things being found on the field they're not supposed to be but even when during playing it's reading some of the the communications that we got people will picnic in the Outfield the of the of the field so someone hits a ball it could land in their salad or whatever it may be but if there's a field there's actually a real line which puts him outside of the danger area and not to mention the players itself there was also an issue regards to or a solution of collecting funds to put up and down the fence that's that's a good thought but it didn't work very well for mnie which I believe is the name of our police horse which the police department didn't have enough funding for so the public had a campaign to fund and I think it lasted a year maybe two than the funding R now so we can't guarantee there's always going to be the Public Funding to put up and down the fence so I say we'll just see what the process is um I already mentioned about the vandalism so yeah so I'm going to sort of leave it there um I'm going to support this motion uh because we're not actually deciding anything at this time we're letting the public engagement some hopefully better engagement than we had back in 2022 and we maybe we can come with a better solution that's in the middle that will make everyone happier than they are now so thank you okay thank you uh is there anybody else that wishes to speak that has not already spoken to the Maine motion okay if not then we will call the vote on oh I'm sorry councelor Amos it is your motion so you have the last word there's anything else you want to say thank Pon I'll say a few words I want to touch a little bit on what councelor Ridge had to say uh he and I kind of grew up in the same neighborhood both inner city kids I played baseball I grew up in the neighborhood of the old Robert Meek Public School in the summertime you would see me with my bat my ball my uniform my glove and I would head down to City Park or what I knew as City Park as Cricket field that old ball field that you saw that's where I played that ball field was horrible games would have to stop because people would be walking through it um you knew where there were certain divots that if you ran you had a risk of breaking an ankle or whatever it just was not a good good field to begin with when you see a field like this being developed it's an amazing infrastructure I wish I had the opportunity to play on that field all of our youth deserve a great infrastructure to explore a new sport build friendships and be physically active why would we shoot ourselves in the foot by removing a key component of something that we spent so much time and money to build and with proven economic success let's move forward have discussions be open-minded on what this amazing ball Diamond can better utilize for many youth as possible to play baseball and help our local economy I hope you'll support this emotion thanks okay uh so we will call the vote on New Motion number one I believe everyone's system is working so let's give it a try it's not working okay all right we will just put that aside again and we'll revert back to hand votes for the rest of the meeting okay uh so we'll call the vote on New Motion number one all those in favor opposed and that carries by a vote of 10 to three councelor Sanic McLaren and Glenn opposed point of order I voted for it oh I'm sorry uh councel I'm sorry councel osterhoff osanic and Glenn thank you Council mclen okay all right so uh with that we have now dealt with new motion number one thank you so now we will continue with the rest of our agenda um the Galler is of course welcome to stay for the rest of the exciting items that we have in our agenda but if you uh wish to uh to leave that's fine as well okay so uh moving back to report number minutes okay we'll see uh report number 76 from the CAO moved by counselor Tanny seconded by counselor Ridge the report 76 from the chief administrative officer consent be received and adopted okay so there is just the one Clause proposal to name a proposed Private Road David Peach Lane counc Council shaves okay honest say this in a general aspect not specific to this motion but generally regard to this motion I just generally have issues naming anything after person um place thing fine but we've had issues in the past and sort of other cities with history coming up and there being controversy and not saying this could be the case in this point so just on that basis alone I'm not going to be supporting this motion okay I we'll call the vote on Clause one all those in favor opposed that carries by a vote of 10 to three councelor ass osterhoff and shaves a post okay on to report number 77 from the CEO move by councelor Steven seconded by councelor too the report 77 from the chief administrative officer recommend be received and adopted Clause by Clause okay so our first Clause uh we will now have a briefing from Jamie Cook and Eric Carvin and uh from Watson and Associates regarding the employment area lands [Music] review good evening mayor parison members of council and City staff it's a pleasure to be back before you tonight to talk to you about the key findings of our employment area lands review uh if we can go to the first slide so just in terms of an introduction oh sorry I guess I'm doing the slides um so this is the um the third study of uh four um big reports that have been uh coming forward to to council as part of a larger growth analysis and Urban Land need study that our firm is doing as background to the official plan review for the city and so this study we're talking about tonight is the employment area land needs review it's a key foundational study that forms a background document with respect to the long-term land needs for the city's urban employment area lands uh as well as respect to the management of the city's employment areas to the year 2051 and so um a key um deliverable of the study as well is to provide key policy directions with respect to the management of the city's uh long-term employment areas within the context of an evolving um employment Market with respect to to a diverse uh and ever increasing uh diversity of Industrial and Commercial land needs with an evolving provincial policy framework so last time we spoke in uh a or sorry August about the city's residential land needs uh looking at this map here is a map of the city's Urban structure tonight we're going to be talking about the city's employment areas so this is all the areas that you see here on the map that are in the dark blue so these are areas that are going to be accommodating or uh currently do accommodate Industrial Development and our planed accommodate Industrial Development we're also going to be talking about the need for additional employment areas beyond the city's Urban boundary uh within the lands that are currently designated uh for rural land use so I'm going to turn over to Eric he's going to walk through the detail core findings of the study thanks Jamie so as part of our employment area land needs review uh we uh prepared a growth Outlook that looked at employment growth out to the year 2051 we looked at ultimately how that would impact employment area land demand and land needs in the city uh over that uh planning Horizon considering land demand and Supply considerations we've concluded that the city will have a shortfall of employment area lands totaling 45 gross hectares of land uh to accommodate growth through 2051 so with this land need of Just Around approximately 400 gross hectares we anticipate that about 325 hectares of that will be needed uh for primarily industrial uses including manufacturing Transportation distribution Logistics uh and construction type uh sectors we also anticipate that uh of that 405 gross hectares of land about 80 acres sorry 80 hectares will be needed um to accommodate other employment uses including office research and development um knowledge-based sectors and other Innovative uh sectors that are important uh for the city's economic uh vibrancy so with the shortfall of 400 gross hectares um there will need to be through the official plan review project uh an exploration of potential expansion areas uh of the city to accommodate these future uh designated employment lands um these will be looked at in more detail and the exact Urban Land needs May differ from the metrics uh identified through this uh through this study here so uh as part of the employment area lands review uh we prepared a range of strategic directions and policy recommendations to help inform the city's official plan review uh project and so I'm going to present some of the key uh findings uh in these slides first is the importance to recognize that we need to plan for employment uses in Kingston uh in the context of an evolving uh economy we're experiencing significant structural changes uh economic disruptors agents of change uh and the op policies really need to anticipate this evolving nature of the local and Regional economy and reflect the diverse needs of industry and businesses of all sizes large and small over the longer term it's important that the city of Kingston maintain its current separate designations of Business Park industrial and general industrial designated uh lands to help uh inform uh and delineate uh employment area lands planning in the city these separate designations reflect the distinct intents and needs of those areas uh to accommodate accommodate a range of light medium and heavier uh industrial uses it's important as well that the op prioritize the development of complete and comprehensive Transportation Systems um to allow for access to these employment areas Beyond just Auto uh related uh functions including public transit uh cycle uh and and pedestrian opportunities and access as well one important consideration in our study um was the new 2024 provincial planning statement which was just issued last month in August uh and now we need to plan for employment uses within the context of a more narrow definition of how employment areas are defined uh by The Province essentially employment areas uh are now to be limited to uses that are primarily Industrial in nature so as part of the updating of the official plan uh it's recommended that the city review all of its existing employment lands uh sites and identify those that uh align with this new definition and group those sites together into a separate employment category or added as a separate overlay uh in the op uh which clearly identifies these sites as aligning with the new PPS uh definition for employment areas equally importantly it's important for the city to identify all other employment lands um they are also very important to the city because they do accommodate other employment uses uh and it's important for the city to maintain and protect those uh lands as well speaking of protecting employment areas uh it's important to protect employment areas as they offer opportunities to accommodate industrial and other employment uses that cannot be easily accommodated in other areas uh of the community as such it's recommended that the official plan policies that are currently in the city's op are maintained as they relate to the protection of employment lands and this should apply to all employment uh area lands moving forward the city of Kingston uh has a very large and diverse developed employment lands base uh but it's also includes a number of underutilized lands totaling about 150 uh hectares it's important to utilize um uh these lands better over the planning Horizon through intensification efforts the city should prioritize the intensification and efficient use of these existing employment area lands um over time there should be policies in place to encourage the Redevelopment and upgrading of employment area lands that are underutilized to accommodate new industrial activities the city should also explore and monitor opportunities for infill and Redevelopment in these more mature employment areas there's also opportunities for the city to encourage the Adaptive reuse of existing industrial buildings to accommodate uh new industry sectors as mentioned the city has a deficit of employment area land over the planning Horizon as such the city will need to strategically plan for new employment areas um to the year 2051 as such uh it's recommended that the city explore options for expansion to accommodate the roughly 400 gross hectares of land that's needed the city should also regularly monitor employment land absorption and employment density levels to see how it's tracking to the forecast that we've identified the city should also o strive to maintain at all times a 5-year supply of service and ready to develop employment lands um to be competitive in the marketplace and provide for Market choice for for industry the city should also explore phasing policies for these new expansion areas that align with a community area settlement expansion areas so there's synergies uh in planning for future uh growth areas the city of Kingston has historically been a strong uh and successful developer of employment lands um and this Municipal role is expected to uh continue well into the future this is a critical role that the city undertakes um and we see that continuing over the planning uh Horizon the city should however continue to establish policies that promote public private Partnerships When developing infrastructure in new employment areas and new industrial projects the city should also consider policies that Implement FastTrack approval processes for industrial projects such as utilizing and implementing a community planning permitting system to help streamline and expediate uh development projects finally uh the importance of climate mitigation adaptation and resiliency principles is critical the city through its op policy should continue to guide and encourage energy efficient and climate resilient development uh for all employment areas including developing policies to ensure Industrial Development considers long-term greenhouse gas emission reduction targets encouraging Compact and Transit supportive employment areas development promote efficient industrial clusters and explore opportunities to attract investment in renewable energy systems such as geothermal and District energy uh with in employment areas and finally to develop new employment areas with green infrastructure uh practices and that concludes our presentation okay thank you very much are there any questions councelor too thank you mayor pson through you um I know it's late so I'm going to be brief about this um we're predicting out to TW 25 years down the road of what our needs will be and we're talk talking about expanding the urban boundary which of course is carries with a whole bunch of problems um your firm and I'm just curious about this what's your track record on making these kinds of long-term predictions I agree we need to prepare but I also want to make sure that we're not we've got a lot of feedback about expanding the urban boundary and I share some of the reluctance of our community about doing so this is an ask to expand it and I and prepare for it um what's like the history of of your predictive record of making these kinds of predictions of what it what's need for urban growth um I'm just looking for a little bit of background into that and I I I remember I asked about comparators previously so I'm just curious a bit about the record there sure thank you through you Mr Mr Mayor um it's a little bit of a trickier one to maybe answer from last time um but I can say that um when it comes to long-term projections you know we're typically in that range of about a 5% range when we go out about 10 years uh 10 to 15 years and then that gets a little bit wider as you get further out which is sort of the reason why we have these ranges in our long-term projections for growth um when it comes to employment it can be it can be bit more challenging employment's harder to project we're going to go through periods of contraction expansion um but we do have a pretty good track record of trying to you know uh understand absorption Trends and project uh project those those Trends forward we we've got a good track record of um looking at densities and projecting where densities are heading on in employment areas and similar to the the community area the residential discussion we've done these studies all across Ontario and and throughout Canada and um I would say that this is this is not a small amount of land that we're talking we're talking about 400 hectares but it's um it's not the it's not in the you know the big fields of you know numbers that you might see in a large you know GTA municipality but this is a this is a big number so it it does fall within that you know um uh you know I think uh appropriately sized amount of land that you might find in a in a in a midsize City in uh in Canada um and um I think there's a need to be looking at proper phasing policies uh as well as we as we go forward to ensure that we're that we're servicing and phasing and um um ensuring these lands are provided in an orderly manner just like we're going to be doing with the the uh the community area side so I think that's probably the best I can answer that okay councilor senic thank you your worship through you um when you had one paragraph in your um report that talked about like um sensitive environmental lands and you said that you're not recommending where to move the urban boundary to but you mentioned you know there's um has to be appreciation for an updated natural heritage system you know if if there's going to be industrial lands around there and I see in your exhibit a map right you show industrial areas around some of our major Creek systems like little catara creek so I just wondered what cities do you see where they have done employment lands and done a good job with protecting natural heritage systems while developing employment lands around that natural heritage system yeah know that's uh that's a great question um so the map you're referring to U references currently designated employment area lands uh in the city um obviously as part of any expansion um the Quantum of you know need that we've identified would be explored through the official plan review project process and and ultimately um you know environmentally sensitive lands would be considered as part of that uh when considering uh location options so we have not looked at those as part of the employment area lands review we would leave that for the official plan review process to uh to consider um as far as communities that have been quite Progressive in this area uh one city that is very similar in size uh to Kingston uh that comes to mind is the city of gal um so they have a very wellestablished employment lands uh inventory and and base and they have been um very sustainably uh expanding their employment lands to accom accomodate future growth in Industry um the Handlin Creek Business Park is is one of their key projects uh it's a public private partnership um and there was extensive work done to make sure that it was developed in an environmentally sustainable manner um and and certainly um you know those torts of natural heritage features were considered um and and were were obviously not you know non-developable areas uh that were excluded from from designated employment uses thank you thanks for giving growth as an example my second question is often we see in like we'll develop a business park but then instead of getting a lot of businesses we end up getting retail like we get bars and like nothing against bars but like our business parks are supposed to be you know for like you said right manufacturing right um you know um all those different types of uses you gave not retail I know that sometimes you come and you give us um an update on our retail capacity in Kingston so how can we or it will be even stores in our business Parks so when you talked about policies will you actually be helping staff develop those policies that can prevent our business Parks from just turning into another strip mall um certainly your your your comment and and and question is is well taken um certainly one of the one of the um advantages of the new PPS uh that I mentioned uh from the from the province is that uh for for employment areas are really intended for for industrial uses and the focus should be on on that and not certainly not on on retail so that in itself will help the city uh sort of guide and and inform the type of development that will be accommodated with within employ areas um and certainly prohibit you know retail type uh uses um for other employment lands in the city that um are really intended for more of that Innovation economy office research and development type uses uh that I mentioned you know that's that's really important for those knowledge-based jobs that you're also attracting and and those need a home as well um but certainly we recognize through the work that we've collectively undertaken in this growth study that um there are needs for for retail commercial uh uses to serve the the the population and the growing population but there are obviously opportunities to com accommodate that within Community areas uh and not within employment area lands thank you K thank you mayor Patterson thanks for the report and um just wanted to ask like when the provincial policy spoke about only industrial Focus are you able to explain the rationale behind that and why it would seem to handcuff a lot of municipalities and why wouldn't they allow us to be a little more creative with like can you speak into that at all and understanding why the government would do that I'll take a through you Mr Mayor I'll take a stab at starting to the respond to that so as you know the province's Mandate is um primarily about providing more housing uh in Ontario and so a lot of what you I personally and I think professionally what you see in the in the PPS is a is a document that's really driven to uh really try to achieve that ultimate goal not to say that they're not trying to provide complete communities because there are policies in the PPS with respect to complete communities but one of the U with that objective of unlocking housing and ultimately unlocking housing in um in some some cases it could be areas around H or Transit some of those areas may be areas that are um uh currently uh where there's some Industrial Development so there's opportunities to relook at those areas to provide more density it's very hard to achieve very high densities in areas that provide Industrial Development so so that's so that's sort of one aspect of it um I think um the other you know the other aspect is they're they're um um lost my train of thought a little bit here but um um sorry I to I've lost it but is there is there Freedom I'll come back to it yeah yeah sorry did you have a question well sorry I trying to help you yeah sorry is there freedom is there some creativity allowed within there do this seems binding to me because we we just finished an economic strategic plan with our withd and and we we we we dream the dream of what we're actually good at and Industry isn't necessarily there so we almost have to redo what we just did uh but I think that when I think we think about Transportation our location geographically you know there's a there's a lot of things that we key in on and I'm wondering if you read that and were you able to um you know dovetail some of it into what we want to do yeah I'll just maybe finish up my thought maybe and Eric might speak to us some more of the specifics on the policy um but um I think there's just been a real clear Focus to for the province to try to provide a real distinction between areas that are accommodating industrial and areas that are not so um so we have this map that we showed that you know these are areas that are Community areas these are areas that are employment and that so that blurring of the lines I think um you know does um I think does pose some challenges in terms of you know how are you defining what an employment area is and I think the the province has taken a more rigid approach to that to um really take a approach of these are areas where we're accommodating Industrial Development and keep in mind some supporting uses that are ancillary or accessory to those subordinate uses but uh really trying to discourage um again free standing uses that are non-industrial nature because again I think where I was going with the other point is they're trying to focus those other um non-industrial uses like the office uses major office uses to areas where we can accommodate High clusters of density typically around Transit uh oriented locations like um um you know uh hirer transit or or um other um other other areas that are um highly dense there's like there's clearly some shortfalls to this policy because of really the two aspects that I think really fall out of this that are challenging are one um how to accommodate these knowledge based uses that are um in our mind really employment um generating uses like your Alcan business park for example that wouldn't be necessarily an area that's Industrial in nature um um and there's also the the challenge of these non um low order non-industrial non-commercial uses like auto repair or some of the other types of non-commercial uses you might see in in an area like the old industrial Business Park where those lands go so um so what we've tried to do is develop policies in this report to help address some some of the maybe unintended consequences of this policy direction to recognize the the province's direction um but also recognize the uniqueness of the city and the city's local policies and how those policies are designed to protect and enhance these areas of innovation that may not fit the mold of the province so I don't know didn't conf yeah thank you for that and I I also point to page 12 which you did I'm as I represent the rural area so I do appreciate uh including um some of the ideas of the proximity to the 401 I've been pointing to that for years and hopefully we can do something with that as well um I wanted to ask about um did I did I miss the map related to the existing uh underused areas in the city I appreciated that because I think everybody points to that and we'd love to find ways of developing the underused areas so I would if you want to speak to that again but I would like to know did we is there a map that shows that or not did I miss it yeah through uh through you Mr Mayor there is there is no map as such in in the report uh it's it's more of a qualitative and and sort qualitative discussion on on underutilized uh lands okay I think we do I think that's something we could do but uh thank you for that and a Hector is three acres is it 247 2.47 I knew it was okay and um thank you commiss H thank you and through you just to to add to the commentary uh councel I want to assure Council that there is a change in the provincial policy there is a change in the definition um in terms of trying to understand the motivations I would say the motivations primarily were also to provide municipalities with additional flexibility relative to the changing Market certainly there's a level of protection that's afforded to what's considered employment versus other uses but those other uses are accommodated in different land use designations they just don't have the same privacy or priority of protection as a as they would have once been afforded under the planning act so if anything it's given municipalities more flexibility I believe intentionally to allow for economic change things happening within the marketplace and then some less restriction on some of those uses but also to Mr Cook's Point making sure that municipalities are adequately protecting for some of those larger industrial uses particularly with we've seen with the proliferation of manufacturing returning to North America and some of those employment trends that we see so I think it's a balance between the two but I don't want Council to feel concerned that some of the other uses that have been specifically identified as part of the world Economic Development strategy are no longer able to be protected or given a level of employment use they'll just be called a different designation under official plan but still be prioritized as needed areas relative to filling their places within the market thank you that's very helpful thank you okay are there any other questions okay gentlemen thank you both very much thank you uh so with that we will move to Clause two employment area lands review Council rich thank you uh thank you your worship U just a couple quick questions for staff um uh which we we had a delegation earlier so I'll ask uh Mary's questions um Can can staff comment on Collins Bay being available for housing or for Land employment does there any updates or information about that se hurle thank you and three Mr Mayor so we do have conversations um I would say quite regularly with the MP's office in terms of properties that may be available or that the city could possibly access um this one has not been a property identified by the federal government at this point in terms of potential disposition and to our knowledge there is no plan at this point for uh this property thank you inter your worship um is it possible to add uh future locations to the employment lands classification as they become available so for example if Collins Bay were too later be um available from the federal government would that be an option commissioner EG thank you and through you um the city has the ability to amend its official plan at any point in the future so certainly if there was land that became Ava available and we needed to convert it from one type of land use to another we would be able to do that take it through the the public process so there's no fear the land's not available now CEO hurdle is indicated certainly we do have those conversations we continue to consult with the federal government at their willingness relative to the official plan process that's going to unfold over the next 18 months and certainly if it becomes available outside of that window then we would always work to accordingly bring it in and assign it an appropriate land use designation thank you very much thank you cancor Amos thank you may Patterson I'll be very quick um just a long time Kingston observation the the 401 seems to be that magic barrier um that the city just won't go past or through or around or under and I'm just wondering in this 25-year plan it's not a fence it's a road move on I'm wondering in this 25e plan I mean we've gone decades now with no possible Avenue of moving forward past the 401 is our infrastructure so limited in our ability to look at employment lands just on the other side of the 401 is it that limited that it's just not conceivable even in the next 25 years commissioner EG uh thank you and through you so I would say there's still a lot of analysis to do we do know from work that's been done in the past that it's incredibly expensive and we would have to think about that relative to the investment in the economic return but what is good relative to the evolution of planning policy in the province that's happened under the new PPS is that there are considerations or greater considerations for communal servicing or private servicing of rural lands relative to business uses compared to what we've seen in the past so I think there's strategies that we have to look at how we can encourage that development even just north of the 401 but on communal services or different systems other than being on full municipal Services we'll certainly be looking at all of the water Wastewater Hydro infrastructure as part of the evaluation of the 25 year plan but what we're seeing right now is that we have land available that's more contiguous versus having to go under over the 401 but certainly it's it's never completely off the table but the logistics and the expense are quite considerable so we're looking at other alternatives to support development in those areas okay okay uh councelor senic um thank you your worship I'm not going to um move an amendment but I will explain that I don't like the word Endor so you know have the last council meeting right I would rather have seen the word receive and I don't believe in expanding the urban um boundary out either um you know startech we were with this with startech and now startech doesn't exist they tore the building down life cycle you know the lands are empty Assurance the building is up for lease so um I'm voting against this thank you okay we will call the vote then on Clause two all those in favor opposed that carries by a vote of 12 to1 councelor oranic opposed okay uh clause three amendment to development charges bylaw to extend effective terms all those in favor opposed and that's carried Clause four housing accelerator fund update Council too thank you mayor Patterson through you uh I just want to highlight the excellent work of say staff of this budget and the amount extra amount of money that we're getting for affordable housing uh I used via messenger that we spent two hours debating a fence in the field um and we're allocating probably unanimously $3.6 million to a $20 million budget of affordable housing I hear from the community we're not doing enough for the people the three or four people watching at home still after this last debate $20 million in our 2024 budget funded through cmhc's housing accelerator fund this is absolutely impressive and great work for all of us we are taking the housing crisis very seriously thank you great okay we'll call the vote on Clause four all those in favor opposed and that's carried okay under report number uh 78 from Kingston Heritage properties committee moved by councelor Glenn seconded by councelor osterhoff that report 78 from the Kingston Heritage properties committee be received and adopted would anyone like any of the items in this report separated if not we'll vote on them as a whole he all those in favor opposed and that's carried okay uh on to report number 79 from the Arts recreation community policies committee moved by councelor shave seconded by councelor Amos that report 79 from the Arts Recreation and Community policies committee be received and adopted okay there's just the one Clause community garden policy update all those in favor opposed and that's carried okay we have nothing from Committee of the whole we have no information reports uh miscellaneous business we have one motion uh moved by Council McLaren seconded by councilor Steven that is requested by Bonnie Sparrow home children Canada Kingston City Council proclaimed September 28th 2024 to be National British home child day in the city of Kingston all those in favor opposed and that's carried we've already discussed New Motion number one are there any notices of motion if not Madam clerk o for minutes please moved by Deputy Mayor Hassan seconded by councelor Ridge that the minutes of city council meeting 19 2024 held Tuesday August 13th 2024 be confirmed all those in favor opposed and that's carried we have some tabling of documents a number of communications is there any other business counc too thank you mayor parison through you I'll be brief and I won't use any baseball puns that should keep everybody happy uh I'd like to just to highlight two groups uh this past Monday um Kingston and District labor Council for hosting Labor Day in MC Bernie Park they did an excellent job uh there was a lot of great speakers and a lot of great events in booths it was great to see a few other counselors there and I'd also like to highlight the community event held at Lake Ontario park by our MP and MPP uh Mark Garson and Ted Shu I I know several counselors also helped out there with delivering pizzas councelor Hanan uh councelor shaves and councelor chenan uh great work I will highlight though that the Labor Day uh one in MC Bernie Park did have an Elvis impersonator so Anne Parker the ball is in your court although the singers at the Lake onter Park were amazing so great job at celebrating the contributions labor continued to make to our great City and our great country thank you thank you okay if there's no other business Madam Clark russer bylaws please mov by councelor osterhoff seconded by councelor Steven that bylaws 1 through 9 and 13 be given their first and second reading all those in favor opposed and that's carried moved by councelor osterhoff seconded by councelor Steven that bylaws 1 and 3 through 13 be given their third reading all those in favor opposed and that's carried motion to adjourn please moved by Council Ridge second by councilor shaves all those in favor oppos and we're adjourned thanks very much